Presidential Election 2025

[Gatsbygirl]

Martin in general has shown great political nous over the last 15 years, bringing FF back from the political dead and keeping the SF wolf from the political door, as it were, plus making strategic choices at critical times on issues like abortion and same-sex marriage. His political antennae have failed him wretchedly on this occasion. He should have swallowed his petty pride and gone with Kelleher. Listening to him on the radio this morning, I think he would have run rings around the other two.

I agree with you about Martin. But could it be that he is just in the job too long?

That kind of political longevity can breed hubris and a certain arrogance and sense of invulnerability and entitlement. (I don't know the man. He doesn't come across as arrogant. I'm just guessing)

Then too, he has been consistently shown in polls to be the party leader with the highest approval rating. This was poll after poll. He topped the leader opinion polls even when FF were in a slump.

Maybe this all round consistent approval went to his head somewhat, and he thought that he could walk on water.

[Brabantje]

Up ntil now, Martin was renowned for his political judgement. It's baffling how it deserted him on this occasion.

Oh, this is not the first such disaster. This is merely the most obvious one. Gráinne Seoige anyone?

[Socthesecond]

The knives seem to be out from Michael Martin, on News Talk radio FF elected representatives were being openly critical of him personally and of the party leadership in general. Not great.

[Gatsbygirl]

The knives seem to be out from Michael Martin, on News Talk radio FF elected representatives were being openly critical of him personally and of the party leadership in general. Not great.

It's hard to call

FF-ers are as tough as nails. Political shenanigans are bred in their bones. They don't take fright easily

This is not FF's first rodeo

They've been through all manner of disasters and PR fukk ups---Haughey, Lenihan, tribunals, Bertie, the Galway tent, "resting in my account".."on mature recollection"..Pee Flynn.....not to speak of the worst financial crash in the history of the state

They will do the thing that is most useful for their survival. Nothing else. They are not "shocked" at Gavin or Martin. Nothing shocks them

For FF, it's just another day at the office. It's life and life only.

[midlander12]

I agree with you about Martin. But could it be that he is just in the job too long?

That kind of political longevity can breed hubris and a certain arrogance and sense of invulnerability and entitlement. (I don't know the man. He doesn't come across as arrogant. I'm just guessing)

Then too, he has been consistently shown in polls to be the party leader with the highest approval rating. This was poll after poll. He topped the leader opinion polls even when FF were in a slump.

Maybe this all round consistent approval went to his head somewhat, and he thought that he could walk on water.

Yes, way too long. I always assumed he would retire from active politics after handing back to Varadkar in December 2022, and then run for President this time. If he did, we'd probably be debating whether Connolly would get her expenses paid.

Instead it was Varadkar who went (though I actually thought he would go in 2023 as well).

Overall, FF and FG have been defying political gravity for years. They barely held on in 2020, and even a moderately competent opposition would have swept them out last year, as happened everywhere else in the democratic world. Instead, the opposition parties basically pretended to ignore the existence of each other and barely held their own, leaving FF to rake up most of the new seats. That's why I'd be putting the champagne on ice for the moment if I were them. They are lucky it's FG, with its unique record of fecking up winnable election campaigns, that they're up against.

[Random Lurker]

[Irish History]

I think most people recognise that anything that was done in the early years of the state are not comparable in anyway to what we should accept nowadays.
Anyone committing armed robberies against innocent businessmen and involving themselves in criminality, dissident Republican activities when we have a peace agreement in place for almost 30 years, are nothing but scumbag criminals.

Just so you know - you are confusing and conflating the 26 county State with Ireland our country.

Members of Fianna Fail and Fine Gael who raided gun shops and private houses for guns, and ended up in Leinster House, instead of jail, did the raiding of behalf of Ireland - not the 26 county State.

The exact same reason Shannon tried to do the same thing - on behalf of actual Ireland.

Your heroes, the occupying British, also called men who became members of Fianna Fail and Fine Gael who raided gun shops and private houses for guns "nothing but scumbag criminals" (words to that effect).
.

[Bubblypop]

Just so you know - you are confusing and conflating the 26 county State with Ireland our country.

Members of Fianna Fail and Fine Gael who raided gun shops and private houses for guns, and ended up in Leinster House, instead of jail, did the raiding of behalf of Ireland - not the 26 county State.

The exact same reason Shannon tried to do the same thing - on behalf of actual Ireland.

Your heroes, the occupying British, also called men who became members of Fianna Fail and Fine Gael who raided gun shops and private houses for guns "nothing but scumbag criminals" (words to that effect).
.

No one cares about your ridiculous 26 county V Ireland nonsense in this day and age.
People care about criminals and stopping them, no matter what their motive.
We voted to accept the GFA and no one believes in criminal activity to bring about a united Ireland. We have a political and democratic way to achieve that aim.

[Berties_Horse]

We have a political and democratic way to achieve that aim.

Kindly proceed at your discretion, one is all ears.

[Irish History]

No one cares about your ridiculous 26 county V Ireland nonsense in this day and age.
People care about criminals and stopping them, no matter what their motive.
We voted to accept the GFA and no one believes in criminal activity to bring about a united Ireland. We have a political and democratic way to achieve that aim.

The only one posting nonsense here is you. You should read the Constitution and learn.

The vast majority of Irish people do care in this day and age - have you ever seen a serious poll that suggested otherwise???

Who is we - because people in the south voted to change articles 2 and 3 of the Constitution, not for the GFA per se.

And just so you know - your heroes, the occupying British, referred to patriotic Irish people who took up arms to free Ireland as indulging in "criminal activity".
.

[Bubblypop]

The only one posting nonsense here is you. You should read the Constitution and learn.

The vast majority of Irish people do care in this day and age - have you ever seen a serious poll that suggested otherwise???

Who is we - because people in the south voted to change articles 2 and 3 of the Constitution, not for the GFA per se.

And just so you know - your heroes, the occupying British, referred to patriotic Irish people who took up arms to free Ireland as indulging in "criminal activity".
.

Yawn. No one cares about you referring to our State as the 26 counties.
And I have a law degree, where I actually studied the constitution.

[Irish History]

Yawn. No one cares about you referring to our State as the 26 counties.
And I have a law degree, where I actually studied the constitution.

What part of "the vast majority of Irish people do care in this day and age - have you ever seen a serious poll that suggested otherwise" did you not understand???

And my dick is bigger than yours.

[Bubblypop]

What part of "the vast majority of Irish people do care in this day and age - have you ever seen a serious poll that suggested otherwise" did you not understand???

And my dick is bigger than yours.

Good man, well done on your penis size. Quality over quantity my friend.
And can you point out any poll about whether we live or refer to our state as the 26 counties or Ireland, or a poll showing people's opinions on that?

[Irish History]

Good man, well done on your penis size. Quality over quantity my friend.
And can you point out any poll about whether we live or refer to our state as the 26 counties or Ireland, or a poll showing people's opinions on that?

What do you imagine you mean by "quality over quantity" - do you think I have two?

You are clearly a very confused person - do you really really really have a law degree?

[John]

It's absolutely ridiculous that Gavin's name is remaining on the ballot paper.

[Guburnor]

MOD: Irish History and Bubblypop can you please cut out the bickering, thank you.

[Brabantje]

It's absolutely ridiculous that Gavin's name is remaining on the ballot paper.

This is not a new scenario, and exactly what should happen.

[Return of the Mac]

Interestingly as Gavin remains on the ballot and any vote for him will be valid and counted, if people vote for him out of protest he could very well end up with more votes then if he's stayed in the contest.

[midlander12]

It'd be funny if the result was something like 49/49 and then 2% for Gavin, and his transfers decided it.

A bit like Dick Spring, after four years as Tanaiste with FG, held onto his seat by 4 votes thanks to transfers from FF.

[schmittel]

For 1 seat the quota is 50% + 1 presumably irrespective of whether there are two or three candidates on the ballot?

[Statsman]

Given that there are, in effect, only two candidates, I'd love someone to explain to my why it's vital, in our STV system, that I vote all the way down the card.

[Statsman]

For 1 seat the quota is 50% + 1 presumably irrespective of whether there are two or three candidates on the ballot?

50% + 1, I imagine.

[Socthesecond]

I'm even more strongly tempted to write "Neil Steen's moustache No.1" on the Ballot Paper...as was noted earlier it's grown on me.

[midlander12]

For 1 seat the quota is 50% + 1 presumably irrespective of whether there are two or three candidates on the ballot?

Yep.

I presume also it's as valid to put 'X' beside one candidate as it is put a No 1.

[Gatsbygirl]

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/fia ... 14846.html

Indo headline saying they contacted FF about Gavin having a tenant issue before any selection was made

Surely if this is true, it has serious implications for Martin.

(Sorry, this should have gone onto the Michael Martin thread)



From the indo article -

The email sent by the Indo to FF was:

“Following on from the request for an interview, would you mind letting me know when Jim Gavin will be responding to media queries,” the email said.

“I have some specific questions I wish to put to him about property interests and a particular issue arising with a tenant when he was a landlord.”

And according to FF, Gavin denied there were any issues when this was put to him.