Vaccine megathread

[isha]

Only famous for his mad covid statements - nothing else.

https://www.snopes.com/news/2021/03/26/ ... n-bossche/

That is a lie. To dismiss an expert so casually just because he does not align with your POV is foolishness.

He started work as a vaccine developer in 1995 and from then to 1998 worked in Belgium as a Senior Project Leader on Raw Material Traceability (RAMATRA) and vaccine projects in Late Development, e.g., Herpes Simplex Virus type 2, Hepatitis B, Streptococcus Pneumoniae and Enterotoxic Escherichia Coli (in collaboration with SBL Vaccines, Sweden).
He did that for 6 years and then went to work as Head of Adjuvant Technologies and Alternative Deliveries, R&D in Glaxo Smith Kline in Belgium for the next 5 years.
He then did a year as Director, Research Program Leader and Head of Adjuvants with Novartis in the USA specialising in research on RSV vaccine development.
After that, back to Europe, to the Netherlands where he worked as Global Project Director for Solvay Biologicals working on research into dose sparing re Influenza Vaccines.
Back to America then for 3 years work at GAVI, the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, where he was responsible for operating Vaccine Programs (e.g., HIV-1, Malaria, TB, Polio) and coordinating and spearheading international collaborations and consortia on innovative vaccine approaches and steering multidisciplinary vaccine initiatives in a global context.
He was busy enough with academic engagements after finishing up that in 2011 to 2015. These are a few of his qualifications and teaching positions re Virology and Vaccinology
- Postdoctoral Fellowship in Virology at James A. Baker Institute for Animal Health, Cornell
University, Ithaca, NY 14850, USA (Sept 1990- mid 1991)
- Research scientist in Virology, Immunology and Molecular Biology at the Robert Koch
Institute in Berlin, Germany (1987- 1990)
- Board certified in Veterinary Virology (1990)
- Senior Research Scientist and Head of Environmental Virology at University of Hohenheim,
Stuttgart, Germany (1990-1994)
- Board certified in Veterinary Microbiology and Animal Hygiene (1992)
- Visiting Professor in Environmental Virology at the European Faculty for Environmental Sanitation
(1998-2004)
- Adjunct Professor in Environmental Virology and Zoonotic Diseases at University of Hohenheim,
Stuttgart, Germany (1997-2000)
- Visiting Scientist at the REGA Institute, KU Leuven, Belgium (2013 - 2015)

In 2015 GAVI had him back to work as Program Manager, where he was tasked with coordinating GAVI’s Ebola Vaccine Program and contributed to the implementation of an integrated vaccine work plan in collaboration with Global Health Partners (WHO, Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, CDC, UNICEF), regulators (FDA) and vaccine manufacturers.

He founded UNIVAC in 2014, researching universal vaccines.
In 2017 he was Head of the Vaccine Development Office, at the German Centre for Infection Research.
He was also managing director at this time of his own company VARECO which was providing consultancy on vaccine project management as well as advice, guidance and expert opinion on preclinical development of vaccines & biologicals.

After almost 30 years working at the highest levels globally on research and development of human vaccines, their program development and implementation and being well trained in virology he has been an independent researcher of vaccine products for the past few years.

[kadman]

If he is educated enough for understanding this, then yeah I reckon he could be called an expert.

Continuing Education
 Pandemics and Epidemics; Workshop on prevention, preparedness,
response and recovery; Interdisciplinary colloquium at the
Chatham house, London, UK, Oct 2015
 Global Pandemic Preparedness; Research and development summit
and workshop (WHO), Geneva, Switzerland, May 2015
 Global Vaccine Development for World Health Symposium.
Workshop on Regulatory Pathways of Vaccines for Global Diseases.
FDA, EMEA, Emerging regions, NGO, and Industry Perspectives.
Bethesda, MD, USA, Nov 2009
 Master Class – Vaccine Safety. Canadian Association of
Immunization Research and Evaluation (CAIRE), Ontario, Canada,
Feb 2009
 Master Class – Vaccine Efficacy, Canadian Association of
Immunization Research and Evaluation (CAIRE), Vancouver,
Canada, Sept 2009
 Nanotechnology in Pharmaceuticals and Biotech; Examining
progress towards commercialization of nanotechnology in drug
discovery, development, delivery and diagnostics. NH-Amsterdam
Centre, The Netherlands, April 2006
 Commercial Strategies in the Pharmaceutical Industry: How to
make the difference? The Center for Professional Advancement,
Den Haag, The Netherlands, May 2004
 Surfactants, Colloids and Interfaces. The Center for Professional
Advancement, Den Haag, The Netherlands, March 2004
 Advanced Course in Liposome Technology and Vaccine Delivery.
School of Pharmacy, University of London, UK, Dec 2003
 Photon Correlation Spectroscopy/ Zetapotential Cursus. Goffin
Meyvis Analytical & Medical Systems B.V., Etten-Leur, the
Netherlands, Feb 2003
 Advanced Course in Liposome Technology and Vaccine Delivery.
School of Pharmacy, University of London, UK, Dec 2003
 Advanced Vaccinology Course. Foundation Mérieux, Veyrier-du-Lac,
Annecy, France, June 2002
 An Introduction to the New European Regulatory System for
Medical Devices, Russell Square Quality Associates Ltd, Rixensart,
Belgium, Nov 2001
 Masterclass for Equine Vets, Intervet Belgium N.V., Brussels,
Belgium, Sep 2001
 Regular education and training in Project Management Skills (‘Goal
Directed Project Management’, Coopers & Lybrand, United
Kingdom), 1998-2000:

[isha]

One thing I truly cannot understand, leaving aside most of the weirdness that is going on, is how come the global media is not all over the story of Uttar Pradesh? If this was going on in the USA or the EU people would be roaring from the rooftops.

Uttar Pradesh had 9 cases yesterday. 9 cases!!!!!!!!
A 7 day average of 11 cases per day. Always less than 30 cases per day since early August.

Uttar Pradesh is one of the most densely populated places in the world. It has 240 million people. That is half the EU population and 2/3rds of the US population. It has an excellent test and trace system, good public records and low deaths per million from Covid overall.

Why is this incredibly wonderful good news story completely ignored?

[isha]

If he is educated enough for understanding this, then yeah I reckon he could be called an expert.

I just want to stress, if it is not clear, that I think choosing this vaccine is a personal issue and is wholly dependent on risk benefit analysis. I have favoured the vaccination of the elderly and infirm from the beginning - it gives them a better chance for sure. It is an individual decision.
Herd immunity cannot come from leaky vaccines of waning efficacy nor can it come anyway with such large zoonotic reservoirs. But the injections may help the vulnerable who are the ones generally affected by this. And risk may outweigh benefit (although I do not know for sure and time will tell.)

But mass vaccination at the height of a pandemic when there is large viral amounts in circulation is the exact recipe for creation of selective mutations that evade acquired (ie vaccine) immunity.
Vanden Bossche has been saying this all along. It was a basic principle of virology until this year. Even the Moderna vaccine inventors Drs Ugur Sahin and Ozlem Tureci are saying it now. Months ago the developer of the AZ vaccine, Professor Andrew Pollard, said vaccines should be targeted and not mass distributed. I feel like I am taking crazy pills that everyone is ignoring this.

[Scotty]

If he is educated enough for understanding this, then yeah I reckon he could be called an expert.

I didn't say he wasn't an expert, I said he was only famous for his Covid talk.



Guess what date he released his 'Doomsday Papers'?

[Scotty]

One thing I truly cannot understand, leaving aside most of the weirdness that is going on, is how come the global media is not all over the story of Uttar Pradesh? If this was going on in the USA or the EU people would be roaring from the rooftops.

Uttar Pradesh had 9 cases yesterday. 9 cases!!!!!!!!
A 7 day average of 11 cases per day. Always less than 30 cases per day since early August.

Uttar Pradesh is one of the most densely populated places in the world. It has 240 million people. That is half the EU population and 2/3rds of the US population. It has an excellent test and trace system, good public records and low deaths per million from Covid overall.

Why is this incredibly wonderful good news story completely ignored?

Probably because like China and Russia, there is not a lot of faith in their numbers.

[PureIsle]

World leading expert? In what? He's a vet that's tried to develop a 'universal' vaccine for animals that he's now trying to push for covid. Only famous for his mad covid statements - nothing else.

https://www.snopes.com/news/2021/03/26/ ... n-bossche/

Hahahahaha ....... yeah, that really tells the true story.

[kadman]

Only EU numbers should be believed, even the ones where Irish government admitted to incorrect numbers at the outset of Covid

[kadman]

I didn't say he wasn't an expert, I said he was only famous for his Covid talk.



Guess what date he released his 'Doomsday Papers'?

Well is he an expert or not?

[Scotty]

Well is he an expert or not?

In Veterinary Virology? Yes. Though if you ask me he job hops a little too much for my liking

Definitely not a 'world leading' in anything though.

[isha]

Well is he an expert or not?

Hahah

[isha]

In Veterinary Virology? Yes. Though if you ask me he job hops a little too much for my liking

He has worked on human vaccines and human virology for 25+ years.
Your argument is silly.

[isha]

Probably because like China and Russia, there is not a lot of faith in their numbers.

Really? You know this how? From what I have read they are very efficient at keeping records.

The Chief Minister of Uttar Pradesh has just announced that immediate family will get 50,000 rupees for any death from Covid in their family. Thats about 570 euros and twice the median monthly wage. It is a good gesture.
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cit ... 094152.cms

[Scotty]

Really? You know this how? From what I have read they are very efficient at keeping records.

Oh it's just a theory. I'm only guessing.

You have to stop reading stuff online and presuming it's fact or purporting to be fact. It's often not.

[Scotty]

I have favoured the vaccination of the elderly and infirm from the beginning - it gives them a better chance for sure.

Ahh so you disagree with the good Dr Geert Vanden Bossche. Interesting.

[isha]

I'm only guessing.

Never a truer word spoken.

[isha]

Ahh so you disagree with the good Dr Geert Vanden Bossche. Interesting.

His argument has been against MASS vaccination. That is all. Mass vaccination is the problem.

[Scotty]

Mass vaccination is the problem.

Very much contrary to what most experts, including 'world leading' ones, believe.

Anyway, enough vaccine nonsense for me for one day

[kadman]

He has worked on human vaccines and human virology for 25+ years.
Your argument is silly.

Not to mention that the early origin of the coronavirus was bats in a chinese market. The bats alone would maybe confirm that a vet was the right man for the job

[CelticRambler]

One thing I truly cannot understand, leaving aside most of the weirdness that is going on, is how come the global media is not all over the story of Uttar Pradesh? If this was going on in the USA or the EU people would be roaring from the rooftops.

Uttar Pradesh had 9 cases yesterday. 9 cases!!!!!!!!
A 7 day average of 11 cases per day. Always less than 30 cases per day since early August.

Uttar Pradesh is one of the most densely populated places in the world. It has 240 million people. That is half the EU population and 2/3rds of the US population. It has an excellent test and trace system, good public records and low deaths per million from Covid overall.

Why is this incredibly wonderful good news story completely ignored?

Probably because it would support a policy of mandatory vaccination.

This is a perfect example of how cherry picking data from exotic, isolated examples of ... well, something ... gets spun into a "wonderful good news story".

The answer you're looking for is there in your third paragraph, isha: Uttar Pradesh is one of the most densely populated places in the world, and it's estimated that - because of this - in the early part of this year, between 65 and 85% of their population were exposed to the virus, some through vaccination, most through natural infection, when the delta variant roared through their densely packed population before the government had a handle on things. Their "excellent" test and trace system only came into being after that, and it's not that excellent either: in terms of tests per thousand, Ireland tests five times as many people as the Uttar Pradesh government. If you don't test, you don't know (reminder: that's how Donald Trump initially wanted to "control" the pandemic in the US). The number of un-tested, un-detected positive cases is thought to be between 85 and 130 individuals for each test administered. So Uttar Pradesh is essentially just an Indian Sweden where the virus was let rip through the population as and how it wanted to, and now they're reaping the benefit of the infamous "herd immunity" ... Hey - it works! At least till someone brings in the ivermectin-resistant Omega variant.

I've kept out of this thread for a while, because I've been waging a "pandemic" war of my own much closer to home, but having caught up now, I think I'll be opting out again for quite a long time. Not because I reject every viewpoint that isn't mainstream science, but (primarily) because those viewpoints are still almost all invariably based on bad science and literature reviews of dubious quality. I'm on record somewhere as saying that none of these vaccines would be particularly effective, because we're dealing with a coronavirus, and coronaviruses don't play by normal rules. I'm also on record somewhere pointing out that I think there's way too much politics being deployed in the supposed control of this particular pandemic. Unfortunately, there's no public record of me pointing out (three years ago) that we would end up in this situation precisely because for every politician trying to do "the right thing" within the limits of their competence and knowledge, there are hordes of citizens around the world determined to engage in all kinds of feckineejitery in the name of "freedom" ; and even more prepared to believe the feckineejitery of others without really digging into the data, or rigorously interrogating the hole-riddled publications spewing out of every institute desperate for notoriety and/or funding.

The latest hobby horse seems to be the risk of myocarditis as an adverse effect after vaccination. Hmm. Well ... duh! Covid causes a frequently fatal inflammation of just about all endothelial cells, so it is entirely expected that some individuals (possibly those destined to die from Covid if left to acquire a natural infection) will suffer a mild inflammation of some part of their circulatory system. That's nothing more or less than what led Pasteur to figure out how cowpox could be used to prevent smallpox.

Then there's the obsession with Israel, first held up as a beacon of speed and action; now being used as a propaganda tool against vaccination. I don't think I've ever heard, seen or read as many people take an interest in Israeli medicine before ... but hey, hang on a second. How many of these experiments are controlled for the effect of Semite genes? Does it matter? Well, we know that there are definitely some populations that experience much higher than average specific health issues because of their genetics, so every single study that comes out of an Israeli institute should have a non-Semite control group if those results are to be relied upon. Oh, and then there's the fact that the government in charge has a policy of only vaccinating 60% of the population (because the other 40% are the wrong kind of Semite) so that completely messes up any attempt to extrapolate the data to normal countries.

Those are just two out of a long, long, long series of claims or counterclaims based on armchair science, but the same pattern is repeated over and over again, filling the whole of cyberspace with pseudoscientific diarrhoea - thus ensuring that SARS-CoV-2 will continue to evolve and re-infect us for many years to come.

For my part, I couldn't give a damn about whether the vaccines are mandatory or not. My 30 years' experience of hanging around with various coronaviruses leads me to believe that most of us can live quite happily with them, and for the sake of "the herd" should share them between ourselves as widely as possible. To that end, I was delighted to be able to spend four hours breathing the hot, microbe-laden breath of two hundred non-masked strangers on Saturday night/Sunday morning. As far as I'm concerned, a couple of pretty useless injections is a small price to pay (and they're a damn sight less intrusive, less inconvenient than those even more pointless airport security checks) - but if they turn out not to be useless, at least I know that I'm not likely to suffer more than a bit of a cold should I happen to dance with the Delta some evening.

[Abella]

In the words of Marie Kondo this does not spark joy, and we are only starting to enter the traditional flu season and we have reports of a "super cold" sweeping through the UK, ADE by another name me thinks
The calendar week 40 in year 2021 from Monday, 04.10.2021 to Sunday, 10.10.2021.

[6456739]

Oh look, another meme dump.

[Scotty]

The calendar week 40 in year 2021 from Monday, 04.10.2021 to Sunday, 10.10.2021.

Another chart from that very same report...

[Scotty]

And another...




Pretty compelling evidence that vaccines work and work very well.

[schmittel]

And another...




Pretty compelling evidence that vaccines work and work very well.

If the measure of success is reduction in hospitalisation/death then yes they work very well.

But as it doesn't provide immunity, it's a bit of a joke to even call it a vaccine to be honest.